The only constant in business and life is change.

In today’s episode I’m in conversation with Jennifer McGurk and we are talking all about change, boundaries and values….and how they all change as we, and the humans around us change too.

Jennifer is a registered dietitian and the CEO of Pursuing Private Practice. Pursuing Private Practice is on a mission to empower non-diet dietitians to start, grow, and scale a business rooted in a weight-inclusive philosophy.

Let’s dive in.

Links, resources & mentions

Pursuing Private Practice:

• website

• Instagram

• Podcast - Ep 126 interview with me & Jennifer

Redefining success Dietitian Values Podcast Episode 11

Episode Transcript

Laura Jean 0:02

Hello, hello, and welcome back to this episode of The dietitian values podcast. And it's guest time today I've got the wonderful Jennifer McGurk in the not actual studio because who has - I mean, maybe some people do have podcasting studios, I don't have a podcasting studio - I got my office, I can hear my kids out in the background. Anyway. So Jennifer, thank you so much for coming on to chat.

Jennifer McGurk 0:26

Thank you so much, Laura, for having me. I'm so excited to have this conversation.

Laura Jean 0:30

Yes. Excellent. And I would love to just start off kick off by if you'd like to just tell a little bit about who you are, where you are in the world, and what you're up to at the moment. And what's what, yeah, what you feeling passionate about work-wise?

Jennifer McGurk 0:44

Yes. So like you said, I'm Jennifer McGurk. I'm based in the United States. I'm just outside of New York City. I am the CEO of pursuing private practice. And I think this is going to answer your passion question, because I'm feeling very passionately about reassessing boundaries of my own, so my team can function at their best. So all the people that we serve, can really see an example of how we can always reassess boundaries. And I feel like by reassessing boundaries, and really being in alignment with what you want out of work, I feel like I'm making a bigger impact than ever before. So it has to do with work, but it's really having to do with the bigger picture of life. And I'm just so excited to kick off this conversation.

Laura Jean 1:27

Oh, well, thank you for kicking it off with such a really important piece, because I love that who we are in our business is not just our business, you know, we're not separate people, we are you're Jennifer, in your business, and at home. And Laura here. Like I said, I can actually literally hear the kids outside, l we're humans. Yeah, so and you know, what we're passionate about what you're changing in your business, it changes in your life, and same same when things change in your life, they change things in your business. So what's kind of gonna, we're talking a little bit about that before, so that's probably a good place to start. But so your business has changed over the years, you know, you've you've shifted from being a being a clinician, clinician, you know, like working with, with clients, or, you know, people around their relationships with food and things, and then now into the, which you've been in for a while, the professional space and even that's changing over time and shifted. So what's kind of happened there and have your values, I suppose shown up to or have they played a part and how they havekind of shown up in those decisions and shifts?

Jennifer McGurk 2:32

Absolutely, I think they played the part in helping me make decisions. And it was it's not an easy thing, to make transitions. So let me just start off by saying that every single time I've had to shift my business or make a transition in my life, it's always been challenging. And I don't know, like we were saying before, is that individual is that system? Is that society? What is that, you know, who really knows? It's all those things. And I think for me, it's showing me that I can do hard things. And then I can help other people see that they can do hard things as well. But one of the hardest things I ever did was actually kicking off pursuing private practice. I was a solopreneur, forever, probably three, four years. And then all of a sudden, I had my first baby. And I realised, oh, my gosh, I have 25 clients on my schedule, how and I'm working from, you know, 10 o'clock in the morning to seven o'clock at night, for five days a week, how in the world? Am I going to raise this family? Because I was pregnant at the time, like how in the world, I'm going to raise this family and also run a business at the same time. That was the very first shift that I had into, oh, I might have to make a change. Can you relate to that at all? I'm sure you can.

Laura Jean 3:44

Absolutely. There's always those. I'm gonna always Yeah, I think. And we were talking about it before early to like, you know, we can we can kind of work in those values misalignments for a certain time until there's this rub until this till we can't. And sometimes that comes from inside us, like, you know, just getting uncomfortable. Or sometimes it comes from circumstances outside of us, which just which force a change.

Jennifer McGurk 4:07

exactly what happened to me. So basically, fast forward, you know, my pregnancy, which actually was a really easy pregnancy, for my first I was very, very lucky knock on wood. But basically, everything went smoothly, I delivered and had my first son, which is so so crazy to think about back in 2014. And I had hired somebody at that point to come onto my team to help me cover for maternity leave. And when I got back from maternity leave, I had the shift in me. And I said, like, oh my gosh, I don't know. And I think it was a little bit of an identity crisis. So I just want to bring that into the picture because I want to be very truthful and very honest with everyone. It was a vulnerable moment. And I said to myself, I'm coming back to work and I'm excited about coming back to work. But I also knew that I wasn't exactly excited about counselling in the same way that I was, you know, three years prior, and I wanted to move into the professional space. I love business, and I loved supervision at the time, I had my first kind of taste of supervision because I was helping my associate dietitian at the time cover for my maternity leave. And I said to myself, like, I really like supervision, And I didn't even really know what supervision was at that point in 2014. But I liked helping my person kind of figure out what to do with cases, they were my clients already, so I knew them really well. And it was my first taste of working with professionals. And I said to myself having this huge identity crisis as a mother, so just prefacing the story, if I were to tell my son, you know what to do in this situation, I would say, go follow your dreams, like, I want to be the mom that actually does the same for myself. So I started very loosely working with professionals, I was writing the pursuing private practice books at the time, which were little tiny snippets of what it's like to run a business, I would never ever recommend writing a book to kick off a brand. It took me a whole entire year and 1000s of dollars, quote, unquote, wasted, but it's fine. But it kicked off pursuing private practice, because I now had another brand that I was really helping professionals with, and I was helping people with their businesses. So fast forward to 2017. Now pregnant with my second son, I decided to turn those books into a course I had another dietitian help me with that project. And at that time, the online world was like we talked about this before the online world back in the 2014, '15, '16 era was very much centred around diet culture, there weren't a lot of people that were teaching business strategy in the online world, it was just a lot of online marketing strategy, that I said to myself, like other people are selling courses, I bet I could sell a course. So my book series turned into a course, which then turned into a Facebook group. So it became a little bit of an ongoing group coaching programme. But then honestly, two years fast forward of that, I decided to shift it into something different, which is now dietitian business school. So pursuing private practice in and of itself has grown so much from a book to a course to a group programme to now a membership model, because of my value shifting, and because of seeing what could be possible, if this company were to get bigger, and also aligning with my strengths as an entrepreneur, and a CEO.

Laura Jean 7:27

All of those pieces are so important, and I really love that piece of opening yourself up to the possibilities of what can be and yeah, taking action as things change. And the other thing you mentioned in there, around thinking about, how would I want my son to show up, because often with our values, we kind of see our values as something that we show up for other people in versus how we show up for ourselves. So I really liked that. And sometimes we do need that help with like, well, what would I do? I mean, I use a similar thing, when I'm thinking about treating myself with compassion, you know, how would I treat somebody, you know, my daughters, or people that I love? My son too. But you know, he kind of gets rounded up into I've got three kiddos, two girls and a boy. And so I often say my daughters, and he's in ther, my kids. So you know. And so yeah, how would I encourage somebody else to show up in their values? And why is that not available to me, which many dietitians can resonate with, because they probably say the same thing to the clients they work with, the humans they're working with, working with people who show up, who cook these meals that other people like and don't cook things they like themselves, who pack snacks for their kids for their lunch box, but don't take time, you know, like all of those pieces where we turn our values towards other people. So yeah, that's really, really useful to kind of hear that story and hear how values change because I have to talk about that, you know, our values change, but to see that in action, where you've gotten really clear on your values, and how you want to show up in all those different areas of your life and making those changes to support that to be able to show up in that way. And it's not available to everyone, but also often we don't let sometimes that's external circumstances, but also sometimes that's ourselves, we think, Well, you know, this is the way it's always been or this is the only way to do it. Or this is the way I've always done it that would be too different or uncomfortable. often people get stuck in spaces, even though they want to change what, what supports you to make change because they're pretty big changes?

Jennifer McGurk 9:27

Oh, absolutely. I would say the offer itself is probably the biggest change that's evolved over the course of those years. Because the offer and how I'm actually like showing up to the world and saying here are some of my services. Here's what you can purchase from me here are the results of the transformation that people can have. That has changed so much because of just my experience and like how I've decided to put my energy into these certain offers, but also my team has grown so much. So it used to be just me which I cannot even think about right now. Like my company's too big for me to run it by mself, which is actually a really good thing, but also a scary thing. Because now I absolutely need support in order to get my promise out there to everybody like Dietitian Business School is a really comprehensive programme. And we have a lot of different things within dietitian business school. So if it's just me literally in charge of marketing, messaging, copywriting strategy, supervision, like all the different lessons that people get, like, it's too overwhelming, we absolutely need a team to run this company. So knowing that I was at capacity I had to bring on someone else. Okay, now the duo is at capacity, we need a third. And now the three people are at capacity, we need a fourth, like, that's definitely been decisions that I've had to make. And it's been so scary to do so. But just thinking about values, how I don't want my team to be overworked. And it's worth it to me to bring on someone to face that I guess, scary decision of hiring before I'm ready. But it's only ever worked out knock on wood so far, with bringing on people. And I'm very, very thankful for that. Yeah, well,

Laura Jean 11:06

it sounds like you've got clarity around your values and how they change. And I think that helps a lot. Because if you're, you know, I, I'm just me and my business. But if that point were to ever come, I think knowing your values and being able to actually make those choices through your values versus being reactive. Recognising you've got to make this shift, sitting with that, recognising that there's a disconnect there that you can'tkeep going in your business without compromising some of your values and then getting support. And then actually hiring with your values like, is that something that comes into your hiring process? Or when you're thinking about what that next step is? If it's if it's hiring someone, if it's changing things?

Jennifer McGurk 11:56

Absolutely, it can't, I would say values come into. So So I try every single time that I hire somebody to really think like, Okay, who is this person? You know, what are they going to bring to the company, what are their values, because their values have to match our values. I've never, it's and I'm actually very lucky saying this because I know this is not the situation for everybody out there. But anytime I've hired I've always been weight inclusive. So I've never had to work with someone that is a diety type of person. And it is, like, I can't even imagine having someone come into the company that is focused on diets and focused on, you know, all of the harmful things that diets can do. Like I've always lead with the fact that we are weight inclusive company, we are a non diet company. And that's attracted the right people to the roles. So it's really important that we have an alignment there with certain things and we all care about our values that PPP our passion, push purpose and protection. So passionate in the sense that we're trying to do work, you know, working in our zone of genius, most of the time, that does not always happen, because that is unrealistic. And I want to go on record saying that, but we really tried to work on our zone of genius. Purpose is that we change with the market. So we have to be adaptable. Like we're making some changes to dietitian business school this spring and summer because of what the market has asked for. And you can't know that unless you actually like survey your market and see what people are actually really wanting. And then protection is all about boundaries. So we lead with those values, and they're on our website, they're literally in our team meetings, they're in our programmes are in everything that we do. And that will really help attract the right people to the company that when we have an opening, I'm trying to steer people away that are not in alignment with those values and bring on the few people that really are and then make the decision. And I have a whole interview process. But like make the decision from that.

Laura Jean 13:55

Yeah, I think that that's so important. The way what you mentioned there around the values, you get clear on them, but they don't just go on the website, they're in the team meetings, they're there in the interview process. They're actually part of the systems and strategies. Often we think of business strategies as being like the set things outside of us. But actually, our values can guide that, they can be super practical, as well as being like I talk about them being aspirational, you know their dreams as well, but they can be super practical. They can be decision making tools. And thank you for sharing how you use them. I think it's a great example of how when you show up in your values, when you've embedded your values, into your systems into your processes and programmes. It actually signals to humans who have similar values. This could be a space for you. So I love that and not just clinicians that want to maybe work in your organisation but also people who want to work with you, you know, in dietitian business school, because you're really clear around. This is who I am. This is what I show up for and how and that comes through in how you talk and I've listened to your podcast, and it's really clear that your values are there. In the foundation of your business, and it shows that, because sometimes the thing that people often feel a bit uncomfortable with around values or maybe it's not uncomfortable, but I think we've been made to question these things that can you be successful and be values driven? And I think you're a great example of Yes, check. You can.

Jennifer McGurk 15:22

Yes, you can. I will say that 100 times, you absolutely can. You absolutely can. Because success is different for everybody. And who gets to define what success even means? That's the question. And I feel like, yeah, that's the question. Everyone has their own definition of success. My definition of success to this day looks extremely different than what it was a couple years ago, extremely different than what it was when I started, because that's the maybe that's actually a value of mine that has changed over time. What what is your definition of success?

Laura Jean 15:54

Definitely, I think, and I've talked about this explicitly, I'll drop that podcast link in the show notes around defining or redefining success through your values lens, because if you are values, or everyone is driven by values, it's just whether they're yours or somebody else's, right. So if you are leading with your values, or showing up in your values, if you don't have the definition of success that's aligned with that, it's not going to feel like success, when you get there, It's notgoing to feel like success to you, because it's not going to be based in your values. To use an overt examples, like getting a shiny brand new car for success is not going to feel successful if that's not something that's important to you. And no shame, you know, if that is, absolutely excellent, own it, and know what success feels like to you. Because I think sometimes we can swing the pendulum the other way, like then I can't have that, because that's the traditional trappings of success, and I have to find my own, but it's fine if what is seen as the traditional kind of paths and things are for you. But it's about really, like you said, getting clear on what is for you, like what's your values based definition of success, and letting that change. Because, you know, we're both moms of three kiddos, and not necessarily everyone listening is, but my definitions, what I probably saw as markers of success in you know, business before kids versus after kids is different. It shifts, it changes. And as it should, you know, we were like, I love that part of your value. You know, you were talking about like being responsive and changing with the market. But really, it's just being responsive and changing with the humans, you know, and you being a human that as the business owner, but also the humans that you work with. So it's, it's actually been responding to that. So that was some that was really helpful to hear.

Jennifer McGurk 17:38

I never thought about it like that. But you are exactly right. It's the changing market is actually a change in humaneness, and change in values, a change in all of that. makes perfect sense. Yeah,

Laura Jean 17:49

I think one thing I'm really passionate about is, is looking at our language and the words we use, because often we use those labels just to kind of like group people together really quickly. So we can we can be in a shared understanding. And I like to add more words in. So you know, that it's actually the humans we're working with, versus our clients and not saying that other people have to use those words, Absolutely not. But I feel like for me, it helps me to get better, like, what am I really talking about? And it brings it down to the relational piece, which, you know, for me, that's a big part of my values. So not that anyone else has to do that. But like, once I when I hear those words, I think about well, what does that, how does that show up? If we're talking about heat, like what does that mean, in our, you know, humanity?

Jennifer McGurk 18:29

Yes, no, absolutely. And a lot of times, I feel like dietitians, at least the dietitians that I've worked with sometimes forget that we're humans. because we think we have to know all of the answers. I'm sure you've heard of that, too. I'm sure you hear that all the time. It's like, I just have to know the answers. And I have to know what to do and give me this plan. And, you know, can I have a business plan that's going to help me get to this amount of money and outline perfectly like this. And I'm like, that sounds like a meal plan that our clients want us to create for them. When we know that the work is in figuring out the connection to their body and healing from any type of diet related trauma, eating disorder, etc, etc, whatever, whatever your special niches. But it's so funny how sometimes we forget that we are human too.

Laura Jean 19:15

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. And yeah, I'd love if you would be open to talking a bit more about that piece around how those kind of similar diet culture pieces show up, because I've talked about it too, but I'd love your perspective. And what you see, because you work with quite a lot of dietitians coming through and maybe not always thinking about things in that way. But yeah, what do you see?

Jennifer McGurk 20:31

So I've worked with dietitians in all different stages of business. So in dietitian business school, we separate it out into starting, growing, scaling and coasting. There are certain foundations that are similar across the board for business, because it's just having to do with your values, like you said before. But there are certain recommendations and things you just might want to be careful of when it comes to starting versus scaling. But all business things are rooted in diet culture that I have been a part of in online marketing and messaging, I have done courses programmes - and not to say that I haven't gotten useful information out of the things that I've done, but I have been able to spot certain things along my own journey of being entrepreneur, that I would just cringe at sometimes. like there are tonnes of scarcity mentality things out there, where people recommend upsells downsells, get the person's credit card, and then try to upsell them this particular extra thing that you know that they need, so just tell them that they need it, and then they can check out. Facebook ads is a huge ara of diet culture and business showing up. how many times have you heard in the online space, like oh, just find an offer that works and then run ads to it and like watch it grow on evergreen while you're at the beach. You've heard that to fake deadlines, which I can't stand like this is only open for another 12 hours and 36 minutes so get it now versus if you had opened that page the next day, it's a new 12 hours and 36 minutes, you know, there's so much software out there that really is harmful when it comes to people's businesses, because it's creating this mistrust of audience versus business owner.

And I have certainly fallen for some of these things when I was learning about online marketing and like, oh, that sounds like a good idea. Let me do this. Let me do that. I'm gonna try this. But like I quickly learned it was like, that doesn't sit well with me. Like I believe in a true deadline, like this cohort is closing, and we're starting next week. I think that that really helps people make decisions, but fake deadlines and fake scarcity just really bothers me a lot. And I see it as diet culture and business. There's also so many parallels between making tonnes of money and having everything workout, I kind of compare it to like the weight loss stuff. In our world, it's almost like, oh, when you lose this much weight, like your life is going to be so much better, and everything's gonna be fine. When you make a million dollars in business, your life is gonna work out and it's gonna be fine. Like, I hate those messages too. Because let me tell you, like, I've had my company making a tonne of revenue. And I've been in a worse spot mentally than when I wasn't making that much revenue, because now I need team members, I need all this HR stuff, I need job descriptions, I need help with finances, like, it doesn't necessarily mean that everything is always going to work out. And I'm here to call that stuff out. Because I think that's helpful for a lot of people.

Laura Jean 23:32

Absolutely. And it's similarly to how we call it out for the humans we're working with in the kind of more clinician type space where we're calling it out so people can realise it's not them, and learn, like you said before about how it's undermining trust between the business owner and the person coming into the business. It's also undermining trust with ourselves, right? And so same as the way that culture undermines trust for humans in their body and their connection to food. The business culture stuff teaches us as business owners to undermine our trust in ourselves. Like you just said, it feels icky. But often that's brushed away as well. That's a 'you' thing. That's a mindset issue, or you just need to level up. You know, like, it's, it's yeah, there's so many parallels aren't there.

Jennifer McGurk 24:14

So many, so many. I mean, I feel like I could talk about this for days. But what you said is so true. It's like, Oh, if my framework didn't work for you, it's your problem. Like, I also see that all the time. It's like, oh, just insert yourself into this framework. Now, don't get me wrong. I love a framework. I have a framework. You know, Intuitive Eating is a framework, like there are amazing businesses out there with awesome frameworks. However, I do not believe that someone can just insert themselves or their business into someone else's framework and get the exact same result as that person did. Because we each have different strengths. We each have different personalities. We're good at certain things, and we're horrible at other things. And that's okay to actually say, and that's why I feel like it's really important that, I feel like you said this, but like looking at things with a critical eye, like looking at things with a critical eye like, don't be afraid to second guess. Like, is that really true for me? What is that all about? Like, that's really important.

Laura Jean 25:11

Yeah, and running it through your own values as a filter. Using you mentioned it before, when you were doing some of those trainings, you said, like I was able to see quickly what worked for me. And that comes, I think, from having that strong values based foundation. So you can actually run things through your filter. And I felt similar, but I know it's not always the case for some people. And they can get stuck in that. Trying these things. And often, it'll be the blame on the individual if it doesn't work, well you mustn't be believing it. So you're not putting the full effort. And it's not that people aren't believing that it actually it's just a giant values disconnect. It's a huge rub, like people, you know, don't want to be acting in those ways. And so I think, yeah, the first step is to see it as something outside of ourselves not an us problem. And then from there values can lead the way which obviously, I won't hijack the conversation too much.

Jennifer McGurk 26:00

No, I love it, though. I love it. It's so important, it's so important to listen to your values and to own your values, and to really think about those values when you see business things and have to make business decisions for yourself.

Laura Jean 26:12

Yep. And something you've mentioned a couple of times, which I really want to talk about, because I think it is something that people kind of grapple with, and that's boundaries. So let's talk boundaries. I know you're passionate about boundaries, it's in your system, like in your values, which I love. And you've mentioned it, so talk to me anything you like about values, or what you think that as business owners, you know, what are the questions we can ask ourselves around our boundaries, or maybe some like red flags or little signs that we might be needing to look at our boundaries.

Jennifer McGurk 26:49

I absolutely love this. I was just thinking to myself, what comes first values or boundaries? And I don't know if I have the answer to that,

Laura Jean 26:56

I think values and I'll hat tip, who I often do James Olivia Chui Hillman, who is amazing human. And they talk about boundaries, they're just really our commitments to which I, I insert the word values, they use a different word, but yet I see it as our boundaries are our commitments to our values,

Jennifer McGurk 27:13

That actually really helps me because I was just thinking that as my boundaries have changed, I feel like my values have changed. But I do believe that my values have come first, to set the boundaries, but then to then reassess the different changes that I make. It's this perfect circular thing that we were talking about so much. But yes, I absolutely believe in boundaries. I feel like there's no way I could grow a business or even coast in business, which again, is a boundary almost like kind of deciding that I'm not going to build, build, build and grow, grow, grow and hustle, hustle, hustle like there are so many seasons that I can think of over the past almost 11 years of being a business owner, that I've had to actually coast in business, because I just didn't have the capacity to take on more. But yes, absolutely, boundaries are so important.

So for me, I think I'm trying to think of a different categories of boundaries, I definitely think finances come to mind, you know, charging what I believe is fair, and charging a rate that I believe reflects the experience of the group private practice, which was my first business, you know started as a solopreneur seeing clients, then growing into our group private practice, and then charging a monthly rate for dietitian business school that I believe is fair for the value that people get, and the transformations that we've seen, you know, honouring pricing that way. when I have a healthy financial business, I can therefore donate to different organisations that I believe in, I can have money to pay my team members amazingly well, like I can create a company culture that people want to come work for, you know, and if I wasn't charging appropriately, I couldn't do that. So that definitely is one category of boundaries. I think another category is really working in strengths. So I was introduced to Clifton Strengths by my own business coaching programme. I'm a part of Hello seven with Rachael Rogers. And they had a coach at Hello seven, that was a strengths based coach. And I just loved everything that Letendre she worked at Hello seven, I think from 2020 to maybe 2021. But she had us all take Clifton Strengths Assessment. And really working in strengths like I have a tonne of Influencing strengths was a really important aha moment for me. I don't have a tonne of blue, which is relationship strengths that are high up. And it's so funny because I'm sitting there like, oh my gosh, like that's why I was so burned out. When I had seven or eight one to one client appointments back to back even when I switched from client work to supervision. I was still burnt out and I couldn't figure out why and like that's why because I don't have a tonne of relationship strengths that are my you know, top 10 Although I have relationships and it's wonderful, but my strengths are more in influencing and strategic thinking. So I think working in your strengths is really important I cannot, and my team will tell you this, like, I am just at the point where if I'm in charge of something admin related, I'm going to mess it up. And I'm going to, I'm going to create more work for everybody. So I really need to step away from that stuff. And as much as I love to literally send out an email on my own, I just can't, because I'm literally going to mess up the process for everybody else. And then I think hiring is another one that is so important. I know, we already touched on that, but like making sure that the whole entire team isn't necessarily overwhelmed. And to bring on roles, and especially it's been like this lately to bring on roles that are literally something that I am doing, that I know, someone else could do better than me. And that is really what it comes down to with bringing on the right person.

Laura Jean 30:45

Yeah, and in there, there's a lot of like, knowing yourself and knowing, knowing what your strengths are, but knowing also, when to what I can hear through there, and maybe I'm getting wrong, but it's just that real. Yeah, respecting of yourself. And, and real, a lot of compassion and grace for yourself. Like that's not a quote unquote, you problem that when you send the email, you know, to use your words, you know, stuffs up the system. It's, that's not your problem in that that's, yeah, I love that. Because I think often we think that it's us, like, we need to get better at systems or better, you know, that we need to keep, you know, fixing ourselves versus actually just recognising our strenghts. and maybe it's not always available to hire somebody but that there are programmes and software and systems. And there's also ways we can readjust our business. So that maybe isn't a big part of it. So maybe you don't use email as a correspondence, just as an example. But yeah, I really, I really love that Jennifer, and I think it's such a bit that's often missed around stuff is that we don't have to do it all ourselves, like sometimes financially, we can't necessarily afford to hire people. But yeah, it's not an us thing.

Jennifer McGurk 31:55

I want to speak to the solopreneur for a second because I do realise that what I just said might sound a little bit crazy to someone that is just starting, because I've been there myself. And I remember listening to business podcasts, when I was first starting my private practice and saying to myself, I will never get to the place that I'll hire somebody like I can barely afford to do this. And so I definitely have been there. I think first of all, recognising your zone of genius and your strengths from the get go is so important. So you might be a solopreneur for years and years and years, you might even be a solopreneur for 10 years, 15 years. But if you can start recognising your strengths early on, and do more of those things that come natural to you that you're passionate about, that are easy for you to do, it will save you a tonne of time and headaches. And maybe you don't necessarily hire like a full time employee or anything like that. But maybe it can I use a website as an example. This is like a such a good example. Maybe it comes time, like maybe you're two years into business, and maybe you created your first website on your own. And it's time for you to update that website. And instead of spending 30-40 hours on a website, that only gives you like a little bit of a notch up than what it was before. If you pay somebody for maybe let's just say like five, six hours of what it would cost you to see five or six extra clients for a week or two. That to me is such, can be let me say that not necessarily has to be, but can be such a good decision for a business owner. Because you're choosing to literally put money into something that is not your strength, letting someone else take a project from you to not only give you back those hours, but to give you a result that is something better than what you could have done yourself. And I think the minute I learned that was the minute my business started to really grow and then eventually scale. Because it's like I'm not the person that has all the answers like the people on my team have tonnes of amazing answers. And even the people that we serve have even better amazing answers when we ask them what they want. And we're literally creating this company for our ideal clients. It's no longer like my company. It's our company, you know, so I think that that's a really important distinction. When you're just starting like don't let this conversation scare you obviously do what is in your best interest for everything, time money resources. But please don't wait as long as I did to hire somebody that's a lesson that I've learned

Laura Jean 34:33

that like you know for the passing all the things I've ever listened to that's a pretty common lesson is like you generally like most people just keep waiting. And it's not always possible but like you said there's ways we can do it and it doesn't have to mean hiring a team member. you can outsource things in different ways. And sometimes even like some business owners I work with, you know, it's not even necessarily the business stuff. It might be outsourcing the house cleaning or all the other things, you know, so it's that bigger picture piece that was a revelation to me when I first sort of thought, oh, yeah, it's not just inside your business, there's all those things that you can get support in. And like you said before, you know, making sure that we're pricing well, so that we're not losing out and also so that we're paying people in a way that's equitable, and all those pieces that come through with our values. So, yes, I think knowing your zone of genius or your strengths, and knowing your values, and where they kind of come in together is a really important piece I like That's great to hear how it's shown up in your business, and what's kind of happened there. And, and so what's what's happening in in business? You mentioned a little change so I'm curious now.

Jennifer McGurk 35:48

Yeah, so basically, the biggest, I guess, I don't want to say problem, because again, I don't believe that this is a good or bad thing. But the biggest problem that we have over the past six months, is that I am still doing a lot of the operations stuff. And we've had some transitions and team members and people leaving the team and joining the team. And honestly, the operation management of this company, like as big as it is right now is an undertaking, it's huge. And I was I used to be able to do it, well, then I feel like in the past six months, I've been doing it good. And the past, like I want to say the past like two months, I've been doing it, okay, it's the the quality of the operations is definitely decreased. But basically what we've decided, relatively, you know, I guess like in the past week or two, that one of my full time team members, Megan, who is marketing and community is going to take over some of those operations things. And we're going to move some of her job responsibilities over to operations, we're going to move community a little bit to another team member, I'm going to take some of the operations off my plate so I can focus on more of the strategy and programme development, because when you have a big company, and you have this organisational chart of different roles and responsibilities, it can seem like a lot when you're looking at it. But when you only have five core team members, a lot of times people have to overlap in different departments, which is where we are right now, we might not be there, you know, all day every day. But it's definitely something that we're experiencing right now. So multiple people are doing different things. But I really want to get back to programme management and programme delivery. So I want to take some of that on. And in order to do so looking at my calendar, like I have to get rid of some operation stuff. So we are literally transferring some job descriptions around. It's almost like we're playing musical chairs in a sense. But I'm excited because I feel like this really does honour our values and people working in their zones of genius, and to try different things that they're passionate about. Megan used to be involved with sales, and she came to me and she was like, I'm not doing sales. It's like I can't do it. I'm not good at it. I don't want to do it. I'm not converting. So I'm taking that back too. Because I love talking to people and see if they're a good match for dietitian business school. So if you get on a sales call, it will be with me going forward. But I'm excited about that. And I'm really good at it. So I'm excited to kind of get these transitions going.

Laura Jean 38:12

Yeah, and that's great. Like, not only for yourself, but creating that culture where everyone can operate in their zone of genius. And as you said you're taking it back, like it's a change back into things. So if we want to we can change our mind, we can do things differently. And you can realise actually, yeah, these are the things that I really did or do like to do. You know, just because we've outsourced something, or made a change doesn't mean we can't change and change that decision, if we realise it's not the space we want to go. And that's so helpful, I think to hear, Jennifer because often I feel like particularly, you know, in the business world, it's like, you know, startup solopreneur, and then you add these things in almost like it would be a quote unquote, backward step to take things back or to let go of like those higher level things that you're supposed to progress to. But what you're talking about and modelling and showing is that you make your business your own and you and you make it to fit you and the humans that are in your business. Maybe it's just you and maybe there's other people and you have it flexible and responsive to change and us as we change and the world around us as it changes.

Jennifer McGurk 39:21

Oh my gosh, exactly. Exactly. I mean, the thing is, I feel like you said it best the market is humans. You know, we're dealing with real people real humans all the time. How much has our world changed in the past few years? I mean, when we think about that, we've been through so much collectively, together as humans, we've experienced a tonne of trauma. And I feel like people's businesses have definitely changed as a result. There's a lot of people now that are going into business number one because they just want to do what they want to do. There's people that are shifting their business and operating in a different way. A lot of people are virtual now and they're not going back In person, some people are craving in person. So I just feel like the market has done a roller coaster. In the past two years, it's really important for us to think about okay, how do we make changes and shift based on what's happening in our environment?

Laura Jean 40:14

Yeah. And yeah, I love that piece you mentioned, like honouring our humanity in that, like, what's changed and who we are. And just because things are online now, if it works better to be in person, then honour that and work into that. So knowing ourselves best and knowing our values and building businesses to support that, because yeah, I mean, it's the only sustainable option right to have a business that supports us as humans and humans we work with otherwiseit's just a job that you're the boss of. Exactly. Oh, Jennifer thank you so much. And speaking of boundaries, I want to honour yours around time. And I'm just conscious of the time here. So before we wrap up, I just love to ask you, is there a seed? I mentioned this quote to you earlier? Like, we're planting seeds for a forest, we may never get to spend time in - Is there a seed you would like to plant whith humans listening along? Maybe it's a question. Maybe it's a tip, maybe it's something to think about? Yeah, a seed you'd like a seed you'd like to plant.

Jennifer McGurk 41:17

I feel like this is kind of unoriginal, because we just talked about it as forefront of my mind. But what are your boundaries? I think that's the seed that's so perfect for this conversation. Don't be afraid to change boundaries, ask yourself what your boundaries are, and then enforce your boundaries. Because I think that that's also really important too. Like, if this boundary is crossed, slash not met, you know, taken advantage of like, what are what's gonna happen, you know, and deciding that for yourself, it's really important.

Laura Jean 41:45

Oh, so much. it doesn't have to be original, because it's a reminder we all need and that last piece about, yeah, and we're recognising that the person responsible for your boundaries is, you know, often we think that other people have to enforce their boundaries for us. But yeah, it doesn't work that way, unfortunately. Thank you so much, Jennifer. I really appreciate your time and all the wisdom and just the examples you've shared, you really show how we can keep our values in our businesses, no matter what stage we're in, like, it's not just for when we're doing it ourselves, when we've got a team and creating your own values based definition of success, and changing and adjusting to meet that - I love it. And so where can people go if they would like to learn more about you what you do and just to continue the conversation with you?

Jennifer McGurk 42:34

Yes, so pursuingprivatepractice.com is where you'll find everything about the company. We are pursuing dot private dot practice on Instagram, podcast, pursuing private practice, and maybe we can link to your episode, Laura, if this is out by the time our first episode is out, because you've been on the show, too. And yeah, I mean, connect with us. Typically what will happen is on Instagram, it is a boundary of mine to not be on Instagram all day. So Megan will kind of field Instagram and she'll give me the things that I need to respond to. But if you're interested in learning more about our programmes, you can start a message conversation with Megan on Instagram, or contact us and again, that'll go to my admin assistant. So speaking of boundaries, you might not get me right away. But if you want to book a sales call, it will be me and I would love to learn more about your business.

Laura Jean 43:21

Awesome. Thank you, Jennifer. And yes, I I mean, I first connected with you via your podcast. Often everything happens on Instagram these days. But I was actually your podcast that when I was coming back to business stuff after maternity leave with my third kiddo, and just in that consuming stage and stuff, and I stumbled across your podcast, so you gave me company on many long walks. So thank you for that. And so I'd highly recommend that and check out Jennifer's work and head over and connect. Thank you so much Jennifer. I really appreciate your time and the work you're doing just to create that supportive space for dietitians, non diet dietitians, particularly who who want to take that next step into whatever that looks like for their business. So thank you.

Jennifer McGurk 44:02

Thank you, Laura.

Laura Jean 44:04

Great, and thanks so much for everyone listening along. I really appreciate your time and until next time, bye for now.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai